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falktx | wow, I had no idea carla was so popular | 09:35 |
---|---|---|
falktx | http://libremusicproduction.com/news/20150113-end-year-survey-results-2014 | 09:35 |
LAbot | Title: End of year survey results - 2014 | Libre Music Production (at libremusicproduction.com) | 09:35 |
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JackWinter1 | falktx: congrats! is nice to know that someone cares about the work one does, it's kind of discouraging to work on foss and think that no one uses it | 09:49 |
ChaosFan_ | falktx: congrats! | 09:52 |
ChaosFan_ | i can relate to the "midi sequencers are lacking", but off the top of my head I wouldn't know what kind of virtual instrument is lacking (which may be related to my fetish for hardware synths... ;) ) | 09:53 |
* falktx has a new midi sequencer coming up sometime "soon" | 09:56 | |
falktx | synths in general are lacking | 09:56 |
falktx | stuff like sylenth, nexus, etc | 09:56 |
ChaosFan_ | falktx: new midi sequencer? that you wrote? already sounds usable ;) | 09:57 |
falktx | we have tal-noisemaker and zynaddsubfx, plus loomer and u-he stuff | 09:57 |
ChaosFan_ | zyn alone can do almost anything | 09:57 |
ChaosFan_ | imho | 09:57 |
ChaosFan_ | but as I said, I have a fetish for hardware synths, so I don't look around too much regarding virtual synths | 09:58 |
ChaosFan_ | falktx: what are you planning for that midi sequencer? pattern-based like non-sequencer or... what's it called? "time-based" like the midi functionality in ardour? or tracker style? or..? ;) | 09:59 |
falktx | ChaosFan_: it's a fork of a fork | 10:00 |
falktx | old screenshot - http://i.imgur.com/qsDfTH5.png | 10:01 |
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ChaosFan_ | looks somewhat confusing at first sight... | 10:02 |
falktx | still unfinished | 10:03 |
falktx | and I don't have much time for it | 10:03 |
falktx | carla needs to be working stable first | 10:03 |
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ChaosFan_ | ah that's two instances of the sequencer, a carla instance and the zyn gui visible | 10:03 |
falktx | 1 sequencer instance | 10:05 |
falktx | and 1 carla | 10:05 |
ChaosFan_ | oh? | 10:05 |
falktx | the window below is the piano roll | 10:05 |
ChaosFan_ | of the midi track "sequenced by Milgren" - ah | 10:06 |
falktx | carla is loading zyn | 10:06 |
ChaosFan_ | does it have to be multi-window or is it possible to have that in a single window? | 10:06 |
ChaosFan_ | just out of curiosity | 10:06 |
falktx | you mean editing midi inline? | 10:09 |
falktx | I don't want that | 10:09 |
ChaosFan_ | ok | 10:10 |
falktx | ardour and tracktion do that, I really don't like it | 10:11 |
ChaosFan_ | that's alright. | 10:13 |
ChaosFan_ | I personally prefer one-window solutions as I really like tiling window managers. with multiple windows open, the rearrangement triggered by those "temporary" windows sometimes looks awkward | 10:14 |
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ariev3 | hello ? | 15:52 |
ariev3 | I have an issue with ardour3 on kxstudio 14.04 x86_64 | 15:53 |
ariev3 | I didn't have this issue on kxstudio 12.04 with ardour3 | 15:54 |
ariev3 | I have described it on https://community.ardour.org/node/8587 | 15:54 |
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Griffinstein | omg lmms is a direct clone and more of fl studio i love it | 16:21 |
Griffinstein | ghost notes was the only thing i needed and i got them on lmms | 16:21 |
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alex-EU | falktx: evening, a question. Is there any sort of midi learn function for carla plugins? | 17:22 |
falktx | no | 17:22 |
alex-EU | falktx: ok. | 17:23 |
falktx | there's midi-cc automation, but no midi-learn | 17:23 |
falktx | this needs the global midi-input port first | 17:23 |
alex-EU | falktx: right. | 17:23 |
alex-EU | falktx: i'm working with the metro plugin at the moment, and there's no way to kill the volume during playback, hence my question. I could assign a switch on my midi controller for this task. | 17:24 |
falktx | you can use the volume CC | 17:24 |
alex-EU | falktx: Sorry, no way to kill the volume automatically. | 17:24 |
falktx | send volume-CC, value 0, with the channel that matches the "midi control channel" setting | 17:25 |
alex-EU | falktx: yep, aware of that. | 17:25 |
alex-EU | falktx: i've sortof been doing that so far. | 17:26 |
alex-EU | falktx: problem is, i can't define a CC, only a port. | 17:27 |
alex-EU | falktx: i'd like to use a specific cc allocated to my switch, a simple on/off. (Switch on =127, switch off = 0) | 17:28 |
alex-EU | falktx: anyway, i've asked. Moving on.... | 17:29 |
falktx | there are probably midi plugins that can do that | 17:30 |
alex-EU | falktx: looking now..... | 17:30 |
alex-EU | falktx: sorted out, thanks for the tip. | 17:35 |
JackWinter | alex-EU: i have some exciting news. i found something called wine-staging and i was running those patches + wine-rt. just had reaper running a full mix at 64 samples buffer with a rec armed tracked through an ampsim for 20 hours, not a single xrun. i get the impression that there is some patch in winestaging that really help. speculation is that it might be a patch that speeds up disk i/o quite substantially | 17:37 |
JackWinter | maybe this one: https://github.com/wine-compholio/wine-staging/tree/master/patches/ntdll-FD_Cache | 17:38 |
alex-EU | JackWinter: sounds good. | 17:38 |
JackWinter | if it really speeds up disk i/o or provides better caching, then it might be good for your kontakt needs too | 17:39 |
alex-EU | JackWinter: i have ssds here. I wonder if it will help them too. | 17:39 |
alex-EU | JackWinter: indeed. | 17:39 |
JackWinter | dunno, i have rust still :) | 17:39 |
JackWinter | i do keep my audio files on a separate disk though | 17:39 |
alex-EU | JackWinter: aaah, WD-40 computing. The good old days. :) | 17:39 |
alex-EU | JackWinter: how do i apply the patch to the kxstudio wine-rt deb? | 17:40 |
JackWinter | :) i looked today and i have about 2TB of audio recordings, but i suppose i could buy a ssd and only keep what i'm presently working on, on it | 17:40 |
alex-EU | JackWinter: Never mind. That's a silly question, you're on arch. | 17:40 |
JackWinter | alex-EU: the patch command :) | 17:41 |
JackWinter | i guess there is a wine-rt source package somewhere. ask falktx for it, and just add the patch or maybe all of them and rebuild | 17:41 |
alex-EU | JackWinter: Yeah, i tried patching a kernel once, ended up being logged in the lesbian society annual calendar files. | 17:42 |
falktx | JackWinter: afaik most of wine-staging patches need something else to work properly | 17:42 |
falktx | hm, not that one though | 17:43 |
alex-EU | falktx: worth trying with your wine-rt package? | 17:45 |
falktx | I guess | 17:45 |
alex-EU | falktx: you know i'll test it for you. :) | 17:46 |
alex-EU | JackWinter: Well spotted, and thanks. | 17:46 |
JackWinter | alex-EU: don't know if it's that patch. this is the buildscript i used for arch, is the whole shebang: https://aur.archlinux.org/packages/wi/wine-silverlight/PKGBUILD | 17:50 |
alex-EU | JackWinter: Good timing too. The reaper linux naysayers have been out in force again. Will be good if this works, and i can use LOS more often instead. (Thinking into the future here.) | 17:50 |
JackWinter | stupid bigots. was the same crap when people asked for an osx version. imo it's up to the cockos devs to decide what to work on, and not the forum users... | 17:51 |
JackWinter | though i added the wine-rt patch to the above buildscript | 17:52 |
JackWinter | entitled brats... and what have they payed for the privilege of running reaper, $60 or maybe nothing at all | 17:53 |
alex-EU | JackWinter: indeed. | 17:53 |
JackWinter | but twats all around. many linux users are no better :) | 17:53 |
alex-EU | JackWinter: True. | 17:53 |
alex-EU | JackWinter: Will be good if this works. I've got latency set loose, because the read from K/wine is too slow, and i get crackles. (I'm shoving a lot more through it i guess) | 17:55 |
JackWinter | now i need to test the new betas. am curious how well the new VCA functionality is gonna work. have been waiting for 5 years or so for it | 17:55 |
alex-EU | JackWinter: Which means my keyboard is delayed input. | 17:55 |
alex-EU | JackWinter: VCA looks interesting. No doubt it will be done the "reaper" way. | 17:56 |
alex-EU | JackWinter: minimal functions, and a stack of scripts. :) | 17:56 |
JackWinter | in the test, i also upped the media buffer to 2400ms and the render ahead to 400ms. but don't know which of them was helpful yet. think it might be good for playback to up the render ahead, and the only drawback is really that changing a fader or fx and hearing the change takes longer | 17:58 |
alex-EU | JackWinter: right. I'm not streaming audio from inside reaper though. I just use it for midi, and ported out to carla. | 17:59 |
alex-EU | JackWinter: You know that plugins inside carla run as separate processes? Falk told me. As soon as the osc stuff is gone, i'm going to give the RAM test another run. | 18:01 |
alex-EU | JackWinter: i have half the plugins running from one prefix, and the rest on another. | 18:02 |
alex-EU | JackWinter: So RAM may become a non isuue as well. | 18:02 |
falktx | errm, the prefix doesn't matter | 18:16 |
falktx | it's the process separation that does | 18:16 |
falktx | JackWinter: can reaper 64bit load 32bit plugins? | 18:16 |
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falktx | it would mean they have plugin-bridges in place | 18:17 |
alex-EU | falktx: right. I was only remarking on the prefixes, based on my testing with K standalone instances. | 18:18 |
alex-EU | falktx: and reaper with vsts. | 18:19 |
falktx | that would be because you're running 2 reaper instances | 18:20 |
falktx | doesn't matter the prefix | 18:20 |
falktx | anyway, brb | 18:21 |
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JackWinter | falktx: yes, it has a builtin bridge | 18:57 |
falktx | JackWinter: is it possible to force regular "native" plugins to use that bridge? | 18:57 |
JackWinter | how do you mean? | 18:57 |
falktx | renoise can run all plugins as bridges | 18:57 |
JackWinter | run 64b plugins in a separate process? | 18:57 |
falktx | yes | 18:58 |
falktx | if yes, then the issue alex-EU had with wine + too much memory can be worked around | 18:58 |
falktx | by using several K instances (separate processes, bridged) instead of a single big one | 18:58 |
JackWinter | yes, it's in prefs->plugins->compatibility->vst bridging/firewalling | 18:59 |
JackWinter | that's a good idea, why didn't i think about that... | 18:59 |
JackWinter | this is cool, i've never run such a big project as such small latency before | 19:00 |
alex-EU | JackWinter: falktx: I tried the separate process bridge setting in Reaper. Never worked for me. | 19:15 |
alex-EU | JackWinter: Good to hear you're having success. :) | 19:18 |
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JackWinter | alex-EU: how did it break? as like that it ought to run in it's own process but with the same wineserver. but i guess most likely the wineserver is the process responsible for allocating ram, but i'd have to look in the source to check that | 19:24 |
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alex-EU | JackWinter: The same as a single K instance. got to around 28GB-29GB, and same errors, and crash. | 19:28 |
alex-EU | JackWinter: All VSTs of course. | 19:28 |
falktx | hmm weird... | 19:29 |
JackWinter | no, even though they are different processes i think they get the ram allocated in the wineserver (if that's possible?) so i guess the problem is in the winserver. | 19:30 |
JackWinter | alex-EU: or are all your kontakt instances running from the same prefix? | 19:31 |
alex-EU | JackWinter: In reaper i tried both. All from one prefix, and then split between the two. | 19:32 |
JackWinter | i guess it would be easy to check if the kontakt process or if the wineserver is the one allocating gigabytes? | 19:32 |
alex-EU | JackWinter: When i run reaper, for each VST instance i get another reaper process, not the same as Carla, where plugins are clearly separate processes, and show that way in Htop. | 19:33 |
alex-EU | JackWinter: And this is the same, whether i select Bridged, or unique process in Reaper preferences. | 19:34 |
JackWinter | alex-EU: not sure i understand, but who owns the ram? wineserver or the kontakt process? | 19:34 |
JackWinter | alex-EU: ah, i see. so it's just another thread running in the same process? must admit i've never messed with this | 19:34 |
alex-EU | JackWinter: yep. | 19:34 |
alex-EU | JackWinter: with carla, each process has it's own ram allocation, or at least, that's what htop tells me. | 19:35 |
JackWinter | well that kinda makes sense | 19:35 |
JackWinter | alex-EU: so it's the reaper process not the wineserver that has allocated the memory? | 19:36 |
alex-EU | JackWinter: There's a further problem with reaper, in that 25-30 VSTs in one project tends to bog it down, a lot. | 19:36 |
alex-EU | JackWinter: CPU starts climbing rapidly, just to keep it all running. | 19:37 |
alex-EU | JackWinter: As far as i can tell, yes. Reaper allocates the ram. | 19:37 |
JackWinter | alex-EU: could be. at least that kontakt would do that. here it really runs like greased lighting at the moment :) | 19:37 |
alex-EU | JackWinter: I am so pleased you shared that with me. :) | 19:38 |
alex-EU | Grrrr..... | 19:38 |
JackWinter | no doubt :) | 19:38 |
JackWinter | hmm, 128 frames buffer and only 100ms render ahead buffer. think that sounds good. now to let it run for a while | 19:39 |
alex-EU | JackWinter: Now you're showing off. :) | 19:39 |
JackWinter | yeah :) but i don't like the render ahead. change an fx parameter and it takes 0.4 secs until it changes sound. that's kinda sucky. i can live with 0.1s | 19:40 |
JackWinter | but render ahead is a great technique to lower the latency and dsp load | 19:42 |
JackWinter | as so often a compromise. | 19:42 |
alex-EU | JackWinter: Indeed. | 19:42 |
* JackWinter needs a faster computer and no more rust to store projects on | 19:42 | |
JackWinter | maybe someday soon i can get back to working on music instead of playing sysop :) | 19:43 |
JackWinter | been a detour of many years by now | 19:43 |
alex-EU | JackWinter: We have that in common. | 19:45 |
alex-EU | falktx: How's the wine build coming along? | 19:45 |
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falktx | ... | 19:46 |
alex-EU | falktx: right. :) | 19:46 |
JackWinter | alex-EU: surely you know by now how to build a debian package? | 19:50 |
JackWinter | but wine is kinda sucky to build if you want 64bit, as you have to build both 32 and 64b...:S | 19:50 |
JackWinter | falktx: at least it will warm up your room a bit :) | 19:51 |
alex-EU | JackWinter: Not always succesfully. Wine in particular usually ends up being a nightmare. | 19:51 |
JackWinter | yeah, it's kinda sucky | 19:51 |
falktx | I need to get on the desktop more often | 19:51 |
falktx | but it's so damn cold here.... | 19:51 |
alex-EU | falktx: another blanket? | 19:52 |
falktx | the hands "freeze", to the point of where I can't type | 19:52 |
falktx | gloves make typing sorta impossible | 19:52 |
alex-EU | falktx: aah, ok. Happens here if i don't get the fires going early. | 19:53 |
falktx | are there big keyboards? | 19:53 |
alex-EU | falktx: you mean old people's keyboards, with big letters? | 19:53 |
falktx | I mean lots of space between characters | 19:53 |
alex-EU | falktx: i have no idea. Haven't got there yet. :) | 19:53 |
JackWinter | i'm considering mounting our 46" TV on the wall in from of me as a monitor, because with 24" and 1920x1024 i can't read the text without glasses anymore :( | 19:57 |
alex-EU | falktx: http://www.amazon.com/Chester-Creek-VB2-VisionBoard2-Keyboard/dp/B000OCQTWM/ref=sr_1_1?ie=UTF8&qid=1421265476&sr=8-1&keywords=large+key+computer+keyboards | 19:59 |
alex-EU | JackWinter: I have my 47inch about a metre and a bit away. 1920 x 1200 | 19:59 |
alex-EU | JackWinter: I need glasses for close up work | 20:00 |
alex-EU | falktx: http://www.ergonomicsmadeeasy.com/store/specialty/product/big-keys-lx-pc-keyboard/ | 20:02 |
LAbot | Title: Ergonomic Keyboards | Big Keys LX (PC) Keyboard | Ergo Big Keys Keyboards (at www.ergonomicsmadeeasy.com) | 20:02 |
alex-EU | falktx: for real men with big gloves...... | 20:03 |
JackWinter | alex-EU: oops, then you are further down the track than me. i'm considering taking up eye yoga as apparently you can train your eyes for shortsightedness | 20:05 |
JackWinter | or rather against it | 20:06 |
falktx | abced layout!? wtf is that? | 20:06 |
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alex-EU | falktx: :) | 20:11 |
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alex-EU | falktx: http://www.toxel.com/tech/2009/06/29/10-unusual-computer-keyboards/ | 20:53 |
LAbot | Title: 10 Unusual Computer Keyboards (at www.toxel.com) | 20:53 |
alex-EU | falktx: there's one further down that page you can walk on. Seems ideal, you get to code and exercise at the same time. :) | 20:54 |
alex-EU | falktx: and finally, these.... http://www.theendearingdesigner.com/creative-and-unique-computer-keyboards | 20:58 |
LAbot | Title: 77 Creative and Unique Computer Keyboards • The Endearing Designer • Tips, Tricks, Tutorials, Tools and More... (at www.theendearingdesigner.com) | 20:58 |
alex-EU | JackWinter: Has CPU count changed with your new wine build? | 21:19 |
JackWinter | don't think so. i have 4 as i turned off hyper threading | 21:20 |
JackWinter | how do you see the cpu count, in reaper? | 21:20 |
alex-EU | JackWinter: in Htop. | 21:23 |
JackWinter | how could wine change the cpu count in htop? | 21:24 |
JackWinter | well if you drink enough of it maybe :) | 21:25 |
alex-EU | JackWinter: i'm asking if your changes have made cpu use more efficient as well. | 21:25 |
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JackWinter | ah, cpu usage? i thought you saw more or less cpus :) | 21:29 |
JackWinter | haven't really looked at that to be honest | 21:29 |
JackWinter | am more interested in latency than cpu load | 21:29 |
JackWinter | alex-EU: do you see a difference? | 21:30 |
alex-EU | JackWinter: haven't tried the patched version yet. But i've taken note of existing usage. | 21:31 |
alex-EU | JackWinter: And i'll compare it then. | 21:31 |
JackWinter | alex-EU: who knows, if the disk io is more efficient, then maybe you'll see difference | 21:32 |
alex-EU | JackWinter: That's what i'm thinking. | 21:33 |
JackWinter | just tested, seems to use more cpu, but i'm running all the patches from wine-staging at the moment, so it's possible that it's not related | 21:37 |
alex-EU | JackWinter: right. | 21:38 |
JackWinter | no sorry. seems to be the same cpu use for my test project. it's reaper5 that uses less cpu than rp4 | 21:38 |
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JackWinter | typed rp instead of rp5 :) | 21:38 |
alex-EU | JackWinter: interesting. RP5 is more efficient? | 21:39 |
alex-EU | JackWinter: same settings for buffer etc as RP4? | 21:40 |
JackWinter | maybe not. i actually think i installed rp5 in that prefix too (by mistake). but i'm too tired now. but this prj is about 18% now. when i ran it from the other prefix it was about 22%. not sure why that would be | 21:40 |
JackWinter | suppose it will be 64 vs 128 samples.... | 21:41 |
alex-EU | JackWinter: right. | 21:43 |
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JackWinter | gotta go sleep, think i'm getting a cold and have to get up early for work :( | 21:52 |
JackWinter | gnaight | 21:52 |
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alex-EU | JackWinter: night | 22:04 |
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falktx | hmm, so now the tracktion devs want to hire me... | 23:45 |
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