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I don't remember- what level is the mackie outputting at? Is it a -10 or +4

output? I'm not sure what is really wrong in your setup, I'm not seeing

anything that is really alarming, that's why I was asking what levels you

are shooting for in ardour, because you may not need more gain. Also,

halfway up is not necessarily bad on yoru channel gain- if you solo the

channel I believe mackie uses that as the prefader level (master level

should reflect the soloed channel level I mean, before the channel fader,

allowing you to set your gain), and that should be around 0 (or U), with

only the occasional higher peak. Then you've set your gain correctly.
On Tue, Jan 26, 2010 at 11:08 AM, Ectropic Harmony <

ectropic.harmony@gmail.com> wrote:
> On Tue, Jan 26, 2010 at 9:10 AM, Mark Rufino <157audio@gmail.com> wrote:

quoted text
> >

> >

> >> On Mon, Jan 25, 2010 at 12:22:24AM -0600, Ectropic Harmony wrote:

> >>

> >>> I haven't had a chance to test the entire set-up of multiple

> >>> connections just yet (see message below for what I'm thinking about

> >>> trying, I don't know if it'll work) but I have managed to get a basic

> >>> recording going with mics into mixer into delta interface into

> >>> computer.

> >>>

> >>> One issue right now -

> >>>

> >>> Levels.

> >>>

> >>> Really low levels.

> >>>

> >>

> > I'm not sure if, from that, I can determine whether or not I need a

> > separate mic preamps type device.

> >

> > Any ideas?

> >

> > Hopefully it's just a matter of me incorrectly setting levels. :-\ But

> > if I need a preamp device I'll definitely get one.

> > When you saw low levels, how low? If you are using a mixer into your

> delta

> > 1010 then you have mic preamps. If you are plugging a mic into your delta

> > 1010 (which I assume you're not- that is only 1/4" inputs, right?, then

> > those are line inputs and your mic needs amplification. Also, for your

> > condenser mics you do have phantom power, right? Just checking, without

> that

> > they will not make much, if any, sound.

> > However, assuming things are working correctly, what level are you

> shooting

> > for? digital 0 and analog 0 are not the same thing, different scales, so

> > shooting for 0 on your mackie then shooting for 0 in ardour is not going

> to

> > work- ardour ideally should be peaking around -18, maybe a hair higher

> once

> > in a while. That is called 0dbfs (0 decibels below full scale). "Full

> scale"

> > is calibrated to something analog, and -18 is one standard (people

> calibrate

> > to different things depending on the situation), so 0dbfs in that case

> would

> > be +18dbv (I think dbv is the scale, maybe dbvu? doesn't necessarily

> matter

> > though). So if you are recording at +18 analog, that means your mackie is

> > red lighting everything, and a mackie most definitely is not going to

> sound

> > good at +18, and your delta 1010 inputs aren't designed for that either,

> so

> > you're going to get some ugly sound.  Just something to think about, it

> may

> > or may not be your issue.

> > So when you are gain staging, you want each piece in your signal chain to

> > operate where it is meant to operate efficiently. In your mixer, if you

> max

> > out your channel gain then lower the fader, that's not really what you

> want

> > to be doing- the gain is not a "volume control" really, it is meant to

> bring

> > the operating level of your mic to its correct spot. Same thing with your

> > channel faders, you don't want them all up high then the master fader

> down.

> > However, inside ardour, this is different, you can have your faders up

> and

> > your master down, to a degree. Ardour's internal headroom is much much

> > higher than any analog component, so you're not clipping ardour inside,

> but

> > then as you send sound out too loud you're clipping your converters,

> which

> > can be done with some converters, but not something on the m-audio level

> (me

> > either, I have a phonic mixer, probably made in the same factory as the

> > mackie). So keep your levels conservative and you'll get a better sound.

> > If there are inaccuracies to what I've said please correct, but for the

> most

> > part I think my info is correct.

> >

> > --

>

> Thank you for the info.

>

> I recently posted some info about my current connections/level

> settings ("Questions on New Recording Gear" subject).

>

> Here is the bit from that referring to Delta 1010 current settings &

> Envy24 levels:

>

> Default button settings on back of Delta 1010 (buttons out, allowing "+4")

> Software connections via JACK

> Envy24 running, with levels maxed out (ins and outs).

> Ardour (no current changes in Ardour's mixer's levels, using default).

>

--

http://www.reverbnation.com/jeffreybrayne

www.jeffreybrayne.com

http://www.last.fm/music/Jeffrey+Brayne

www.totalsoul.com

www.bigjeffmusic.com
--001636c5c11dfea53c047e145155

Content-Type: text/html; charset=ISO-8859-1

Content-Transfer-Encoding: quoted-printable
I don't remember- what level is the mackie outputting at? Is it a -10 o=

r +4 output? I'm not sure what is really wrong in your setup, I'm n=

ot seeing anything that is really alarming, that's why I was asking wha=

t levels you are shooting for in ardour, because you may not need more gain=

. Also, halfway up is not necessarily bad on yoru channel gain- if you solo=

 the channel I believe mackie uses that as the prefader level (master level=

 should reflect the soloed channel level I mean, before the channel fader, =

allowing you to set your gain), and that should be around 0 (or U), with on=

ly the occasional higher peak. Then you've set your gain correctly.

On Tue, Jan 26, 2010 at 11:08 AM, Ectropic H=

armony <=

ectropic.harmony@gmail.com> wrote:

On Tue, Jan 26, 2010 at 9:10 AM, Mark Ruf=

ino <157audio@gmail.com> wr=

ote:

quoted text
>

>

>> On Mon, Jan 25, 2010 at 12:22:24AM -0600, Ectropic Harmony wrote:<=

br>

quoted text
>>

>>> I haven't had a chance to test the entire set-up of multip=

le

quoted text
>>> connections just yet (see message below for what I'm think=

ing about

quoted text
>>> trying, I don't know if it'll work) but I have managed=

 to get a basic

quoted text
>>> recording going with mics into mixer into delta interface into=

>>> computer.

quoted text
>>>

>>> One issue right now -

>>>

>>> Levels.

>>>

>>> Really low levels.

>>>

>>

> I'm not sure if, from that, I can determine whether or not I need =

a

quoted text
> separate mic preamps type device.

>

> Any ideas?

>

> Hopefully it's just a matter of me incorrectly setting levels. :-\=

 But

quoted text
> if I need a preamp device I'll definitely get one.

> When you saw low levels, how low? If you are using a mixer into your d=

elta

quoted text
> 1010 then you have mic preamps. If you are plugging a mic into your de=

lta

quoted text
> 1010 (which I assume you're not- that is only 1/4" inputs, ri=

ght?, then

quoted text
> those are line inputs and your mic needs amplification. Also, for your=

> condenser mics you do have phantom power, right? Just checking, withou=

t that

quoted text
> they will not make much, if any, sound.

> However, assuming things are working correctly, what level are you sho=

oting

quoted text
> for? digital 0 and analog 0 are not the same thing, different scales, =

so

quoted text
> shooting for 0 on your mackie then shooting for 0 in ardour is not goi=

ng to

quoted text
> work- ardour ideally should be peaking around -18, maybe a hair higher=

 once

quoted text
> in a while. That is called 0dbfs (0 decibels below full scale). "=

Full scale"

quoted text
> is calibrated to something analog, and -18 is one standard (people cal=

ibrate

quoted text
> to different things depending on the situation), so 0dbfs in that case=

 would

quoted text
> be +18dbv (I think dbv is the scale, maybe dbvu? doesn't necessari=

ly matter

quoted text
> though). So if you are recording at +18 analog, that means your mackie=

 is

quoted text
> red lighting everything, and a mackie most definitely is not going to =

sound

quoted text
> good at +18, and your delta 1010 inputs aren't designed for that e=

ither, so

quoted text
> you're going to get some ugly sound. =A0Just something to think ab=

out, it may

quoted text
> or may not be your issue.

> So when you are gain staging, you want each piece in your signal chain=

 to

quoted text
> operate where it is meant to operate efficiently. In your mixer, if yo=

u max

quoted text
> out your channel gain then lower the fader, that's not really what=

 you want

quoted text
> to be doing- the gain is not a "volume control" really, it i=

s meant to bring

quoted text
> the operating level of your mic to its correct spot. Same thing with y=

our

quoted text
> channel faders, you don't want them all up high then the master fa=

der down.

quoted text
> However, inside ardour, this is different, you can have your faders up=

 and

quoted text
> your master down, to a degree. Ardour's internal headroom is much =

much

quoted text
> higher than any analog component, so you're not clipping ardour in=

side, but

quoted text
> then as you send sound out too loud you're clipping your converter=

s, which

quoted text
> can be done with some converters, but not something on the m-audio lev=

el (me

quoted text
> either, I have a phonic mixer, probably made in the same factory as th=

e

quoted text
> mackie). So keep your levels conservative and you'll get a better =

sound.

quoted text
> If there are inaccuracies to what I've said please correct, but fo=

r the most

quoted text
> part I think my info is correct.

>

> --

Thank you for the info.
I recently posted some info about my current connections/level

settings ("Questions on New Recording Gear" subject).
Here is the bit from that referring to Delta 1010 current settings &

Envy24 levels:
Default button settings on back of Delta 1010 (buttons out, allowing "=

+4")

Software connections via JACK

Envy24 running, with levels maxed out (ins and outs).

Ardour (no current changes in Ardour's mixer's levels, using defaul=

t).

-- http://www.reverbnation.com/jeff=

reybraynewww.jeffreybrayne=

.com

http://www.last.fm/musi=

c/Jeffrey+Braynewww.totalsoul.=

comwww.bigjeffmusic.com=
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