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* drobilla` finally gets around to implementing port groups in ingen | 08:14 | |
drobilla` | It'd be really nice if the whole ecosystem actually got along so things like playing a 5.1 video in your media player exposed the right metadata so it showed up in Patchage sensibly, and creating a 5.1 LV2 group in Ingen did likewise and auto-connect worked and so on... | 08:15 |
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falktx | rgareus: regarding plugin uis. we have not just juce, but dpf and your little toolkit too. | 08:26 |
falktx | ntk also has x11 embedding, although not as nice as the others (menus can block event loop) | 08:27 |
falktx | some plugins roll their own little toolkit, like drumgizmo and oxefmsynth (vst only for now) | 08:27 |
falktx | like https://github.com/oxesoft/oxefmsynth/blob/master/src/toolkits/xlibtoolkit.cpp | 08:28 |
falktx | wrl also has rutabaga(?), which seems to work nicely | 08:28 |
* ventosus opted for https://github.com/vurtun/nuklear whose GL backend harmonizes nicely with pugl across platforms | 08:51 | |
falktx | seems very similar to nanovg | 09:02 |
ventosus | there are similarities, yes, but nuklear takes care of all the tricky layouting, widgetery, user input and text editing, is not a simple canvas library | 09:39 |
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rgareus | falktx: how did you find http://dev.drobilla.net/ticket/1157 in just under 30 mins? is there a RSS/Atom feed for that site? | 14:14 |
falktx | I happened to be visiting drobilla's site on the right time :) | 14:15 |
falktx | I'm a person with good timing, I think | 14:15 |
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drobilla | Reading the email notifications on that one during my day of working in C++17 and giving zero fucks about old compilers, let alone 10 point bloody 5, was entertaining in its way :) | 17:32 |
drobilla | (this is such an annoying issue, gcc should just by default support the most recent thing it supports and the option should be there to *restrict* this, not --enable-not-the-language-from-20-fucking-years-ago) | 17:33 |
rgareus | drobilla: and now continue to argue against breaking backwards compatibility :) | 17:35 |
drobilla | rgareus: Meh, we all have our reasonable lines. Mine is well past 10.5 | 17:35 |
drobilla | I mean, I'll fix it, but caring about *building* on such a dusty old OSX is a waste of time IMO | 17:36 |
rgareus | bump suil's major version and I'm fine with it | 17:36 |
drobilla | Uh, no. The major version number means something important, and it's not that. | 17:37 |
rgareus | I'm also not sure what MSVC has to say on the subject (john's probably not using qt5 either and probably also not waf) | 17:37 |
drobilla | No idea, but it's also required of gtkmm these daysNo | 17:38 |
rgareus | gtk2 and gtk2mm are fine | 17:38 |
rgareus | with C89 and C++98 | 17:38 |
rgareus | well whatever | 17:39 |
drobilla | gtkmm2 wasn't last I checked | 17:39 |
rgareus | due to sigc++ | 17:39 |
drobilla | I had to add that flag elsewhere to make a bunch of gtkmm problems go away | 17:39 |
rgareus | it's not a direct gtkmm2 issue, but indirect due to sigc++ (and maybe glibmm) | 17:40 |
rgareus | anyway | 17:40 |
rgareus | drobilla: is there a reason not to apply the patch from http://dev.drobilla.net/ticket/1157 ? | 17:40 |
drobilla | rgareus: Not that I can see, though an non-mandatory check for the flag would be better (for checks that include headers and such) | 17:42 |
drobilla | I figured it would be (hence the conditional), but nope, so that check makes no sense as-is anyway. mandatory=False seems to work though | 17:43 |
rgareus | drobilla: Even if the compiler supports it, enabling it may not be the right thing | 17:44 |
drobilla | Needs an autowaf.set_cxx0x_mode() or whatever but updating autowaf is annoying :) | 17:44 |
drobilla | rgareus: Doubtful | 17:44 |
rgareus | think of C++11 builds | 17:44 |
rgareus | gcc5/6 default to std=cxx11 | 17:44 |
rgareus | forcing it back to c++0x may or may not break things | 17:45 |
* drobilla sighs | 17:45 | |
drobilla | Fiiiiiiiiiiiiiiiiiiine I'll update autowaf with a cascading thing | 17:45 |
drobilla | I'll only have to do it later otherwise anyway | 17:45 |
rgareus | I've helped myself: http://ardour.org/files/deps/suil-0.8.5-gv0.8.4-5-g55e103e.tar.bz2 | 17:46 |
rgareus | includes the patch | 17:46 |
drobilla | I suppose I could be lazy and just apply that | 17:47 |
drobilla | Doing checks and stuff with different flags than the ones actually used just smells like trouble though | 17:48 |
* drobilla should probably do the DFSG thing and just include waf stuff as a submodule | 17:48 | |
drobilla | rgareus: This seems like the most correct thing to me (?) http://pastebin.com/WT65Mqy7 | 17:54 |
drobilla | er, less the unused mandatory thing | 17:54 |
rgareus | drobilla: inside the QT5 case | 17:56 |
drobilla | Set C++11 if possible, C++0x for old things that don't understand that, otherwise just pray | 17:56 |
drobilla | rgareus: Why? | 17:56 |
drobilla | rgareus: Building with different flags than the checks occur for just smells like recipe for future pain to me. I just want to plug this in as my boilerplate for this in everything that uses these flags | 17:56 |
rgareus | also just setting compiler flags without the possibility of a user overriding them strikes me as a bad idea | 17:57 |
drobilla | Yeah, well, maybe, but a bad idea that basically every project ever does | 17:57 |
rgareus | what if CXXFLAGS already includes -std=c++17 ? | 17:58 |
drobilla | (and your patch has all the same problems if qt5 is found, which is incredibly likely, anyway) | 17:58 |
rgareus | -std=zc++11 ? is that 'z' a typo? | 17:58 |
drobilla | I was testing | 17:58 |
* rgareus ->dinner | 17:58 | |
drobilla | Okay, well, we can bikeshed here about parsing CXXFLAGS and trying to interpret them and decide if "equivalent" ones are there and what to replace, and all kinds of other completely unrealistic shit | 17:58 |
drobilla | ooooooooooooor not. I vote not. ;) | 17:59 |
drobilla | (there is no reasonable case I can think of to need to do this for flags like -std anyway) | 17:59 |
drobilla | Yay, waf removed the "unused" variable Options.platform | 18:18 |
ssj71 | that nuklear lib looks very interesting | 18:26 |
drobilla | aaaaaaaaaaaaaaaaaand breaks CFLAGS nuking for debug in recursive projects | 18:27 |
* drobilla sighs | 18:27 | |
drobilla | Why can't there be a build tool that's as shiny and doesn't break every 5 minutes because the developer gives zero fucks about breakage of any and all varieties? :/ | 18:27 |
drobilla | ssj71: Yeah, that one seems pretty cool at first glance. Haven't tinkered with it though | 18:28 |
ssj71 | I'm looking through the examples, not quite sure I fully understand how you bind it to a backend | 18:29 |
ssj71 | or tell it what to draw and whatnot | 18:29 |
ssj71 | but that mixed with pugl might give a pretty awesome toolkit | 18:31 |
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drobilla | imperatively, whenever. in the canvas example in the main loop | 18:31 |
drobilla | Thanks to all that wonderful hidden GL context stuff that GL people like to misguidedly emulate in their libraries :) | 18:32 |
drobilla | glwuoyiawervylib_set_current_static_global_state_thingie_because_I_slept_through_first_year_systems_programming() | 18:33 |
rgareus | drobilla: i vote to simply not set any -std=XXX in suil's wscript and let the user deal with it | 18:35 |
drobilla | lol | 18:36 |
rgareus | drobilla: suil does not need any C++ flags itself | 18:37 |
drobilla | You can vote for me getting a but report about it not compiling every week all you like ;) | 18:37 |
drobilla | Out here in reality, yeah, no thanks | 18:37 |
rgareus | qt5 may or may ot need it.. and then qt's pkgconfig or qmake whatever should provide it | 18:37 |
drobilla | That's nice, but it doesn't. | 18:37 |
drobilla | Do you have any legitimate reason to vote for this gigantic pain in the ass of making it not compiling out of the box on most systems? | 18:38 |
rgareus | how do other qt5 apps compile if qt5 needs C++11 ? | 18:38 |
drobilla | By setting -std, I imagine | 18:39 |
drobilla | Anyway, whatever. Configure passing and build failing is a bug, period. That is the whole point of configure. | 18:40 |
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ssj71 | ventosus: have you considered contributing your nk_pulg implementation upstream? Seems a cross platform backend might be interesting enough for them to put it in the examples | 18:47 |
drobilla | Holy shit, one 14000 line header file | 18:49 |
ssj71 | yup | 18:51 |
ventosus | ssj71: possible, nk_pugl wrapper is still in testing phase though, and upstream only accepts C89, which restrains me a bit | 18:52 |
ssj71 | I see | 18:53 |
ssj71 | ventosus: nice to see that part has already been worked on though | 18:53 |
* ssj71 starting to second guess his rolling-his-own approach he's been working on | 18:54 | |
ventosus | ssj71: here a simple dummy example plugin https://gitlab.com/OpenMusicKontrollers/nuk.lv2 | 18:54 |
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* drobilla idly wonders how batshit a single header pugl would be | 20:57 | |
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rgareus | very batshit | 21:03 |
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rgareus | except also make sure everything is static and hidden (OSX flat namespace) | 21:04 |
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ssj71 | I consider a little file organization a virtue personally | 21:05 |
ssj71 | great if you can keep it simple enough to fit in a readable header, but 17k lines doesn't do that IMHO | 21:06 |
ssj71 | pugl is rather navigable | 21:06 |
rgareus | in pugl maybe 4 header files, API, Linux, Win, OSX | 21:07 |
rgareus | header-only would be awesome though | 21:07 |
drobilla | Yeah, the different platforms make it rather questionable | 21:07 |
ssj71 | I could deal with that, just not one huge one | 21:07 |
rgareus | IDK if osx header-only is feasible though | 21:08 |
drobilla | Yeah, objc is..... special | 21:08 |
rgareus | you can use quartz directly. that works header only | 21:09 |
drobilla | (the API is in a single header now, though there's a few trivial utility ones) | 21:09 |
rgareus | but is a bit of a PITA | 21:09 |
drobilla | Would possibly/probably be much better for Cairo anyway, but I dunno | 21:10 |
drobilla | Meh, anyway, bikeshed | 21:11 |
* ssj71 facepalms | 21:13 | |
* ssj71 begins refactoring the library he just finished adding that uses global vars | 21:13 | |
drobilla | Hm... I wonder if there's a compiler warning flag for that | 21:14 |
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Felix__ | Hello | 22:17 |
Felix__ | Anyone here? :) | 22:17 |
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* rgareus counts 29 heads | 22:54 | |
trebmuh | Hello | 23:04 |
trebmuh | Any question maybe? :) | 23:04 |
* trebmuh wonders how many question rgareus can count :) | 23:04 | |
rgareus | 0 | 23:06 |
* rgareus thinks he already answered the question. Next. | 23:06 | |
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