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| FergusL | rgareus: https://gist.github.com/Simon-L/86f6847f01dec494093c6c090825ca79 finally got it working | 01:32 |
|---|---|---|
| rgareus | interesting results | 01:33 |
| FergusL | had to dig quite a lot into OpenWRT stuff, recompiling, figuring out bugs etc... | 01:33 |
| rgareus | why would aplay hog the CPU Max: 8394 (8ms) | 01:33 |
| rgareus | or maybe this is the NIC (2 connections) | 01:34 |
| FergusL | actually this popped at a moment, the max rose very quickly and didn't move until the end | 01:34 |
| rgareus | FergusL: you could try with screen (1) or tmux | 01:34 |
| rgareus | yeah the average is low. | 01:34 |
| FergusL | rgareus: sure yes, or better finding a way to fork madplay, couldn't get it to run in background | 01:35 |
| FergusL | or well, I really should get a simple alsa/portaudio program doing some audio | 01:35 |
| rgareus | in so most of the time all is fine. but then something can block the scheduler for 8ms (or .8ms in the last case) | 01:36 |
| rgareus | for xruns worst case is what matters really. | 01:36 |
| FergusL | something weird that doesn't appear here, at some point the max would go negative and the avg become like a huuuuuge int | 01:36 |
| FergusL | that's when I hit it hard with the web ui | 01:36 |
| rgareus | mmh, maybe some int/long ARM issue | 01:37 |
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| FergusL | OR, I should mention I did cross-compile the cyclictest program along with the complete toolchain for the platform as well as an image to flash to it, but I haven't flashed it yet, even though I patched libc, I have no idea how it relates to the kernel and the image | 01:38 |
| FergusL | but I still scp'ed the file to the board and... it worked! with the stock firmware just like I received it | 01:39 |
| rgareus | FergusL: in that case I would not worry too much about it. the results look reasonable otherwise. | 01:39 |
| FergusL | (this is MIPS arch, not ARM, hence the horrible hassle with 8GB-ish toolchains and hours long compile time for just a tiny uImage kernel :)) | 01:39 |
| rgareus | FergusL: when you launch jack, is that more like aplay? | 01:40 |
| rgareus | FergusL: I could imagine the difference being block-size. aplay using 1024 or so while madplay 8k or more | 01:40 |
| FergusL | (MIPS is typically found on network equipment, generally has several ethernet on an internal switch, several integrated wlan adapters, actually nothing to do with audio BUT net guys worry a lot about realtime capabilities for pro grade routers and gateways etc...) | 01:41 |
| rgareus | FergusL: well, hard to say what the cause it, but this at least shows that there's some issues to be expected with low-latency audio with that kernel. | 01:43 |
| FergusL | because of the 8ms? | 01:44 |
| rgareus | FergusL: maybe network is hard prioritized in the kernel (if the difference is really ssh vs two ssh | 01:44 |
| rgareus | yeah. | 01:44 |
| FergusL | yeah, ultimately it totally wouldn't have ssh running | 01:44 |
| rgareus | on the MOD Max: 40 # or so | 01:44 |
| rgareus | if you run e.g 128 fpp / 48SPS = 2.66 msec per cycle. if worst-case the scheduler can schedule jack at only 1ms -> only 1.66 msec available for procesing. | 01:46 |
| FergusL | ps showed some other processes but it's great to feel like you're using linux yet "ps" is just 40 lines :) | 01:46 |
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| FergusL | about network, I'd think that given the target market it would be indeed optimised a lot in hw, with some things being async | 01:47 |
| FergusL | I was surprised SSH didn't seem to have any effect | 01:47 |
| FergusL | about the 8ms, I think I might have done something in the webui at that moment | 01:47 |
| FergusL | I'll retry tomorrow | 01:47 |
| rgareus | well you do run -p 80 so that's rather large priority | 01:48 |
| rgareus | sshd is probably run at normal userspace priority | 01:48 |
| rgareus | FergusL: check ps -eo pid,class,rtprio,ni,pri,pcpu,stat,comm --sort -rtprio | 01:48 |
| FergusL | rgareus: to give you an idea this is what I have next to me: https://dl2.pushbulletusercontent.com/qWreN3X67RPEM05011mZs4BY6T6A1lkJ/IMG_20160702_034243021.jpg :) | 01:49 |
| FergusL | erh, I'll remind about that tomorrow and will report back! | 01:49 |
| rgareus | nice headphone | 01:49 |
| rgareus | 5 times as large as the board :) | 01:49 |
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| FergusL | hehe, the plan was also to show it off and to note that the quality was really ok | 01:50 |
| FergusL | yes and cpu board itself being only the top part, one third of the base board that is only for audio | 01:50 |
| rgareus | power via USB here? | 01:50 |
| FergusL | http://paste.leloop.org/?7a972f6f40c30200#Rx5onyjkSvv0LtAiIgcoWjr2REiIGyP6T+6PTY0NAMc= | 01:50 |
| FergusL | yes | 01:50 |
| rgareus | ok that does not show priority of thr processes | 01:51 |
| rgareus | FergusL: uname -a ? | 01:51 |
| rgareus | mmh there's ksoftirqd. I guess that's a rather recent kernel. can you specify kernel boot options? | 01:52 |
| FergusL | it's 3.18 iirc | 01:52 |
| rgareus | threadirqs in particular | 01:52 |
| FergusL | i'll check all that tomorrow! thanks for your interest | 01:53 |
| rgareus | k. | 01:53 |
| rgareus | 'night | 01:53 |
| FergusL | actually, are you still in France? if i'm not mistaken you used to work at Paris 8 | 01:54 |
| rgareus | I used to. | 01:54 |
| rgareus | I'm in Brussels now. for 2 more months | 01:54 |
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| FergusL | sorry for this network interruptio rgareus | 02:05 |
| rgareus | n/p | 02:06 |
| rgareus | I didn't say anything. | 02:06 |
| rgareus | FergusL: are you based in France? | 02:06 |
| rgareus | aah yes you are, we had that before, didn't we? | 02:07 |
| FergusL | hu maybe we had! Yes I'm in Paris | 02:07 |
| FergusL | I mostly hang out with people who seemed to know you, people from /tmp/lab and Blackboxe, does that ring a bell? | 02:08 |
| rgareus | quelle arrondissement ? | 02:08 |
| rgareus | yes and yes :) | 02:08 |
| FergusL | ok so maybe you're not aware of all of it but blackboxe moved, and then moved again, and then again etc... now it's merged as a new entity "Jack" in Montreuil | 02:09 |
| FergusL | I live outside of Paris, southern suburbs | 02:09 |
| FergusL | http://jack.tf | 02:09 |
| LAbot` | Title: Jack is alive! (at jack.tf) | 02:09 |
| rgareus | jack that should be jacques, no :) | 02:10 |
| FergusL | I really insisted on Jacques but not everyone enjoys the vintage sounding legacy in names | 02:11 |
| FergusL | the secret meaning is that it's JA and Hack, JA being Jardin d'Alice, the artist collective we're part of | 02:11 |
| rgareus | did you run into Jason Cook ? | 02:11 |
| FergusL | haaaa probably, from Canada right? | 02:12 |
| rgareus | USA, but he emigrated ages ago long time in France | 02:12 |
| rgareus | he ran the Digital Arti Artlab | 02:12 |
| rgareus | Milo ? | 02:13 |
| FergusL | sure ! haha | 02:13 |
| FergusL | he's not so much around these days, Barzi (Vincent R.) is much more | 02:13 |
| rgareus | say hi to him. I still owe him 20 euros | 02:13 |
| rgareus | :) | 02:14 |
| rgareus | Barzi does not ring a bell. | 02:14 |
| FergusL | i'm basically "the sound and music guy" at the space so they did tell me repeatedly about you | 02:14 |
| rgareus | Vincent does though.. but there were two | 02:15 |
| FergusL | yes, we have lots of Vincent | 02:15 |
| rgareus | heh | 02:15 |
| FergusL | was working with Maurin D. on etextile, also quite some Arduino stuff and Kinect interactive installations | 02:15 |
| rgareus | cool. sounds like it's thriving | 02:16 |
| FergusL | you can hop by anytime when/if you're back in Paris, just tell me and i'll arrange to have as many of these guys around at the time! | 02:16 |
| rgareus | well, I'm in progress of moving the other direction :( via A'dam to Berlin. | 02:17 |
| rgareus | anyway next stop is the bed... bonne nuit | 02:18 |
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| FergusL | bonne nuit ! à bientôt | 02:19 |
| FergusL | thanks for the inspiring chat :) | 02:19 |
| rgareus | you're welcome. | 02:19 |
| rgareus | I'll certainly ping you when I'm heading towards Paris again | 02:19 |
| FergusL | great! | 02:21 |
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| FergusL | hm is https://enzienaudio.com/docs/index.html#1.introduction unavailable to you as well? | 15:39 |
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| falktx | yes | 16:02 |
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| FergusL | just when I needed it! haha | 16:16 |
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| FergusL | rgareus: # uname -a Linux mylinkit 3.18.21 #5 Fri Nov 20 12:43:14 CET 2015 mips GNU/Linux you asked about that last night | 17:19 |
| FergusL | you also suggested I run a specific ps command ps -eo... seems the stripped down version of base utils GNU executable doesn't have a ps with all the options, -e and -o aren't recognized | 17:21 |
| FergusL | also was it you that linked to an example portaudio/alsa application a few days ago? | 17:22 |
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| rgareus | FergusL: portaudio no. alsa: https://github.com/moddevices/mod-alsa-test | 17:25 |
| FergusL | http://equalarea.com/paul/alsa-audio.html#playex meanwhile I found that. Thanks | 17:26 |
| LAbot` | Title: A tutorial on using the ALSA Audio API (at equalarea.com) | 17:26 |
| rgareus | FergusL: but it's not likely to help unless you're going to debug the kernel driver. | 17:26 |
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| rgareus | or if you want to write your own ALSA-only player | 17:27 |
| FergusL | I think that's something I'd like to do! | 17:28 |
| rgareus | well, depends. jackd is fine for most cases | 17:29 |
| rgareus | 3.18 can be configured with threadirq (no rt-patch needed) -- that may help (prioritize the audio i/o IRQ) | 17:30 |
| FergusL | again I won't have jack on the board I'm using! also I mentioned Heavy from enzien audio last time, this is what I plan on using (make a pd match, compile it as "static" C in just a few files and use it to process the sound and feed that to alsa) | 17:32 |
| FergusL | does that make sense? | 17:32 |
| FergusL | also really cool about threadirq you just mentioned! patching for rt seemed possibly needed but very daunting at the same time | 17:33 |
| FergusL | http://users.sussex.ac.uk/~thm21/ICLI_proceedings/2016/Practical/Workshops/129_Bela.pdf if you want to read a bit about what exactly I'm aiming at, it introduces similar project | 17:42 |
| FergusL | I've been digging these papers as well for my masters thesis, I realise I haven't seen Mod being mentioned anywhere :/ | 17:43 |
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| FaTony | falktx, if it legal for DPF plugin to output values that exceed -1;1? I get xruns if I do | 18:19 |
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| falktx | FaTony: depends on the host | 18:39 |
| falktx | not sure if there's rules for it, but doesn't seem like good practice | 18:40 |
| falktx | same as outputting denormals. if possible don't do it :) | 18:40 |
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| FaTony | falktx, carla host | 18:41 |
| falktx | depends on the engine mode I guess | 18:42 |
| falktx | going over +1.0f means it will clip anyway | 18:42 |
| falktx | so yeah, I'd avoid it at all costs | 18:42 |
| falktx | if a host connects it directly to the speakers... you might break them ;) | 18:43 |
| FaTony | ok I will add saturator | 18:44 |
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| nocomply | I've just installed debian testing, followed the steps on the kxstudio website to add the repos but I'm not sure what to do next, I am getting this when trying to install all http://kxstudio.sourceforge.net/paste/sSr6a | 19:42 |
| LAbot` | Title: KXStudio Paste (at kxstudio.sourceforge.net) | 19:42 |
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| nocomply | sorry, think konversation just died | 19:44 |
| FergusL | nocomply: hi, did you try installing lower sets ? | 19:45 |
| FergusL | there are meta packets for smaller subsets | 19:45 |
| FergusL | mayber -audio or something (kx has video stuff too iirc) | 19:45 |
| nocomply | FergusL: I didn't, I wasn't sure if that was what I should do or not, I guess it's the same thing right? | 19:46 |
| FergusL | $ apt-cache search kxstudio-meta kxstudio-meta-audio - KXStudio meta-packages - Audio kxstudio-meta-audio-plugins - KXStudio meta-packages - Audio plugins kxstudio-meta-audio-plugins-dssi - KXStudio meta-packages - DSSI Audio plugins kxstudio-meta-audio-plugins-ladspa - KXStudio meta-packages - LADSPA Audio plugins kxstudio-meta-audio-plugins-lv2 - | 19:48 |
| FergusL | KXStudio meta-packages - LV2 Audio plugins kxstudio-meta-graphics - KXStudio meta-packages - Graphics kxstudio-meta-video - KXStudio meta-packages - Video kxstudio-meta-restricted-extras - KXStudio meta-packages - Restricted extras kxstudio-meta-all - KXStudio meta-packages - All kxstudio-meta-audio-plugins-vamp - KXStudio meta-packages - Vamp Aud | 19:48 |
| FergusL | io plugins kxstudio-meta-audio-plugins-vst - KXStudio meta-packages - VST Audio plugins kxstudio-meta-audio-plugins-collection - KXStudio meta-packages - Collection of good audio plugins kxstudio-meta-wine - KXStudio meta-packages - Wine kxstudio-meta-live-conflicts - KXStudio meta-packages - live ISO conflicts | 19:48 |
| FergusL | erh sorry that's not pretty, I have kxstudio-meta-audio installed, does it work for you ? | 19:51 |
| nocomply | I can do it I think but it's a long output which loads of suggested, guess I'll just do all the metas I want, I wasn't too bothered about the videos one anyway | 19:52 |
| FergusL | apt-cache show kxstudio-meta-audio shows a list in its "Depends:" | 19:56 |
| nocomply | oh that's handy, thanks | 19:58 |
| FergusL | but I think it installs more than just this list, falktx will know better there :) | 19:59 |
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| nocomply | hmm ok got audio one installed but getting this now http://kxstudio.sourceforge.net/paste/EFuzd | 20:14 |
| LAbot` | Title: KXStudio Paste (at kxstudio.sourceforge.net) | 20:14 |
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| FergusL | nocomply: this is weird | 20:28 |
| FergusL | I haven't done this in a long time | 20:28 |
| nocomply | FergusL: I have no idea, I've only ever used the distro before so I have no idea why it's not working | 20:31 |
| nocomply | falktx: do you know what might be causing this? | 20:31 |
| FergusL | have you installed a supported version? | 20:33 |
| nocomply | FergusL: of debian? | 20:34 |
| FergusL | i've never used Debian with Kx, I've always started from ubuntu | 20:34 |
| FergusL | yes | 20:34 |
| nocomply | just debian testing | 20:34 |
| FergusL | actually, I know those errors too well from repeated install failures that I have had | 20:38 |
| FergusL | and I find them deceptively (un)informative, it's like "no, it's not possible" | 20:39 |
| nocomply | I'm starting to think perhaps I should just go back to kxstudio iso | 20:39 |
| nocomply | yeah FergusL, that the problem I've always had with this package manager, I don't particularly like it | 20:39 |
| FergusL | still I try to keep with Ubuntu as much as possible | 20:40 |
| FergusL | no really it should work | 20:40 |
| FergusL | does "apt-get install helm" work? | 20:40 |
| FergusL | oh, what's your architecture? | 20:40 |
| nocomply | FergusL: no, another impossible situation, libpng not installable | 20:41 |
| nocomply | it's 64 bit | 20:42 |
| FergusL | whats the output of "apt-cache policy libpng" ? | 20:43 |
| FergusL | libpng12-0 or something that's available | 20:43 |
| nocomply | N: Unable to locate package libpng | 20:44 |
| FergusL | yes just libpng doesn't exist, what package is exactly "libpng[...] not installable", what did it put where I wrote the brackets? | 20:45 |
| nocomply | helm : Depends: libpng12-0 (>= 1.2.13-4) but it is not installable | 20:46 |
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| FergusL | ok so apt-cache policy libpng12-0 ? | 20:49 |
| nocomply | none for candinate or installed | 20:50 |
| nocomply | this doesn't make sense | 20:50 |
| falktx | you might need to enable the gcc5 repos | 20:50 |
| falktx | do you use ubuntu 16.04? | 20:50 |
| nocomply | falktx: debian testing | 20:50 |
| falktx | yeah, that needs the gcc5 repos | 20:51 |
| nocomply | falktx: I installed them as the kxstudio website says, is there something else I need to do? | 20:51 |
| falktx | not really | 20:52 |
| falktx | nocomply: did you install the updates yet? | 20:52 |
| nocomply | falktx: yeah there was a jack package but that's it | 20:53 |
| FergusL | (well at least it made the sense of not being installable) | 20:53 |
| falktx | try installing helm first | 20:54 |
| nocomply | falktx: http://kxstudio.sourceforge.net/paste/mb3gQ | 20:55 |
| LAbot` | Title: KXStudio Paste (at kxstudio.sourceforge.net) | 20:55 |
| FaTony | nocomply, right, I'm on Debian testing too and get the same error message | 21:00 |
| FaTony | I just don't use HElm etc. | 21:00 |
| FaTony | I use JACK, Rosegarden, LinuxSampler | 21:00 |
| nocomply | oh ok FaTony, maybe it's not just my install then. I might have to go back to kxstudio iso in that case | 21:03 |
| falktx | ah that shit | 21:03 |
| falktx | I'll have to rebuild helm | 21:04 |
| nocomply | well zam-plugins worked so at least the repo is working | 21:08 |
| falktx | I know what the issue is... | 21:09 |
| falktx | let's see if I can push an update to fix it | 21:18 |
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| falktx | update incoming | 21:43 |
| falktx | nocomply: fix should be available in a few hours | 21:43 |
| nocomply | ok thanks falktx, will that fix not being able to install the metas? | 21:44 |
| falktx | very likely | 21:47 |
| nocomply | ok thanks again | 21:52 |
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| FergusL | rgareus: quick question, I want to test my low level dead simple alsa programs on my host running jack, do I really need to stop it? the programs get the obvious "device or resource is busy" | 22:15 |
| rgareus | FergusL: jack requires exclusive access to the device | 22:18 |
| FergusL | hm :/ I think I'll get another laptop on the table and test my programs there | 22:19 |
| rgareus | FergusL: as does the simple mod-alsa-test. this is intentional so that no other program can change parameters (sample-rate buffersize etc) | 22:19 |
| FergusL | ok, totally makes sense | 22:19 |
| rgareus | you could write tools that don't require exclusive access. but then you need to handle cases where settings can change anytime. | 22:20 |
| rgareus | FergusL: there's an alsa dummy (loopback) device. | 22:21 |
| rgareus | which you could use for testing | 22:21 |
| FergusL | rgareus: I have tested with these devices (Cadence starts it iirc) for now I get an error when I try to use them, PCM set format returns "invalid argument", I'll dig this error a bit | 22:34 |
| FergusL | I'm using pretty old example code I think, I should find newer examples | 22:35 |
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